“Couples, gay or straight, are not statistics and are not subject to what the majority of their groups do in studies and analyses. They are people who deserve the support and encouragement to succeed in their relationships and to have the best possible chance at a long and healthy life together.” - Chris Shultz
I wrote this in response to a Time.com article “Are Gay Relationships Different?” by John Cloud. He wrote the article after his first relationship of over seven years ended.
This article prompted some discussion amongst my Facebook friends about gay relationships. A common opinion is that gay relationships are less permanent, and that straight relationships are often successfully anchored by children. In that article published by Time.com, Cloud mused that if he was in a straight relationship, he would “almost certainly have had children” and his relationship would still be intact.
A Facebook friend commented that “death or heartbreak, all relationships come to an end eventually." So, he concluded that the “length of time as a yardstick for measuring the quality of a relationship would be a poor yardstick indeed.”
I found it understandable why some gay folks will see it from that perspective. My personal experience was that when my relationships failed, it would be hard not to have that nagging feeling that what some said about gays is correct: we can’t conduct personal relationships well. I went through that after several of my relationships ended in my twenties. I told myself that men aren’t meant to stay together – only women held the keys to a lasting relationship.
Now, I find that perspective deeply flawed and offensive. It is offensive to assume that many straight couples could only rely on their children to make their relationships work. It is offensive to childless straight couples. It is offensive to gay couples who never adopted and yet stayed together for decades.
It is also terribly unfair that one would compare relationships that ended by heartbreak, to relationships that ended with the death of a partner.
“What is the difference?” one might ask. Afterall, all relationships end one way or another!
The difference is simple: in one relationship, the partners made a vow. In the others, no vow was made. This is not to denigrate shorter relationships. Even short relationships teach us valuable lessons – and sometimes these lessons better inform us to cherish the next one. But, in short-term relationships, there is no commitment. Let’s stay together if we’re happy and it works for both of us. Once it stops working for either of us, let’s split. There’s nothing wrong with that.
In a committed relationship, a vow to love, respect and cherish each other is one that ends with “till death do us part”. It is a vow not to be taken lightly. It means that a partner vows to stay with another through thick and thin, riches and rags, in health and in sickness. My vow is to be with my partner when he contributes to our relationship. And my vow stands even when he is no longer able to contribute in certain ways (physical disability, aging complications). As long as he wants me around, and as long as I am capable of making decisions, I will be with him.
It’s interesting to note that in the Time.com article, the author used his own relationship as an example of a gay relationship that did not work out. Other than citing statistics that supported his point of view, he mentioned no other gay relationships – not even the ones that worked. It’s like someone who’d just climbed a hill and wrote about climbing Everest – without consulting a single Everest mountaineer. Personally, I have several Singaporean gay couples who are together for over a decade or two, and are still going strong. And I know of a couple from America, Neal and John, who’d been together for 30 years.
While it is true that many gay relationships do not work out, it is also true that gay relationships often lacked the community, familial and societal support that straight relationships take for granted.
Also, Chris Shultz, a friend of mine, noted, “It seems that same-sex relationships haven't enjoyed the social support and approval for long enough to draw meaningful comparisons between same-sex and different-sex relationships and their relative success rates.”
I am reminded of what is a committed relationship - and what makes it last - in, of all things, an animated cartoon. In the first 10 minutes of Pixar’s Oscar-winning animated feature Up, we were shown a compressed lifetime of a childless couple, Carl and Ellie.
When they found out that Ellie couldn’t conceive, the couple was devastated.
In every young gay man’s mind, we have visited that shocking, inescapable conclusion shortly after we dealt with being gay: since our future relationships lacked eggs for fertilisation, we would likely never have the chance to be fathers. While it might not have manifested itself as devastatingly as Ellie’s discovery at the doctor, it certainly was a blow to us nevertheless.
In the film, as Ellie sat sadly on the front yard’s swing, Carl approached her and made her a promise: they would embark on a trip to their childhood dreamland, South America.
Carl didn’t say: “Oops, sorry you couldn’t conceive. That means we can’t have children. Our relationship would never stand a chance without them! I’m afraid I’ll have to leave you.”
Carl said: “Ok, so we can’t have the adventure of having children. Let’s find a new adventure together!”
Some people argued that gay relationships should not work, because they do not satisfy the end goal of marriage: procreation. And some of us believed these people.
While the world needs a steady supply of children, it is also in dire need of many other things. What’s to stop a gay couple from finding an adventure they can both work happily towards? An adventure could be as simple as building a home together, creating a company together or even something as noble as starting and running a charity or orphanage.
Sure, some of us can achieve these singlehandedly. But one thing I learnt when I climbed the Grand Canyon in Colorado, US, alone and witnessed a breathtaking sunrise there two decades ago: I wanted that special someone to share that awesome sight with me. Always.
Otto Fong is a comic artist who'd created Sir Fong's Adventures In Science and an openly gay man since 2007.
"In a committed relationship, a vow to love, respect and cherish each other is one that ends with “till death do us part”. It is a vow not to be taken lightly. It means that a partner vows to stay with another through thick and thin, riches and rags, in health and in sickness. My vow is to be with my partner when he contributes to our relationship. And my vow stands even when he is no longer able to contribute in certain ways (physical disability, aging complications). As long as he wants me around, and as long as I am capable of making decisions, I will be with him."
I just wish I can utter this vow again.
Even though i am single now but i still believe that one day i would be happily attached and even if i do not have the luck to be attached i will still believe in love:)
Having said that, many gays (or at least those i met) are eager for just fun, few would venture into long term relationship. the very word 'commitment' will send them packing! sure, everyone is entitled to his way of life, hence i think its important to know what you really want... and if the other party is also crystal clear about what he wants. IF BOTH SHARE THE SAME GOAL/OBJECTIVE, then its 'A good start' to a relationship :)
But will it last?
Let's just hope for it. Or else everything will just be sad.
I know it will just come fine:).
Notwithstanding that, he should not have represented his perspective as if they were a truism. As Otto rightly high-lighted, it does not explain the "anomalies" that exist i.e. straight childless couples who remain married, gay couples who remain together. Like him, I get irritated when people over-generalise.
Personally, I believe when it comes to relationships, it all boils down to choice. Whether a person chooses to remain single or requires companionship is, I suspect, a matter of personality and life experiences. Some people may not be as comfortable committing whereas others take to it better.
I think the important thing though is to at least experience being in a relationship to decide whether that is something for you. I subscribe to being open to experience and am generally suspicious of artificial constructs which we are bombarded with by the media on a daily basis e.g. artificial constructions of what love might mean.
However, I do agree that gay relationships, no matter how much the family and friends approve, lacks the support the society usually has for straight couples. Society support for the longevity and romance for couples seems to lack in a gay relationship, because the large mass thinks that they should 'leave the gays alone', even though they approve of the relationship.
But I won't put the blame too much on external factors. The mindset of the couples involved are part of the blame too.
Do gay couples think that their relationship is equal to that of a straight? I don't think so. They may accept their homosexuality, but I think many still unconsciously think that gay relationship are not equal as heterosexuals. I've seen too many gay couples trying out new recipes for a relationships, and still failed miserably. Many would argue how because they are gay, different than the norm, then the nature should be different as well.
I really hope that in the future, there wouldn't be any word with label 'gay' in it, such as 'gay relationship', 'gay marriage', or even 'gay sex', or whatever. Being with the same sex is equal as being with the opposite sex.
Separation is not equal.
HELL YES TO FOREVER GAY LOVE!!! =)
But do not hurry the voyage at all.
It is better to let it last for long years;
and even to anchor at the isle when you are old,
rich with all that you have gained on the way..."
Ultimately what does it mean to last?
Does it mean that it is an occasion of celebration when a gay couple who's been together for more than 10-20-30 years, even though they are actually in an open relationship?
Does that mean that the couple who got divorced are less deserving?
Nothing lasts. Marriages, vows and legal contract not withstanding, can crack and result in divorce. Thousands of couples with kids find themselves separating and later divorcing. Clearly children is not the answer to a "lasting" relationship.
A friend once told me... if a couple is staying together only because of the children, then what kind of relationship or love they are having? Obviously none for each other. In such cases, won't it be better to just leave for a better pasture instead of living in misery every day for the rest of your lives?
I also don't agree with the "the world needs a steady supply of children."
Uh newsflash... what the planet does not need is more human beings! We are already overcrowding many parts of the world, furiously destroying every aspect of the planet in our incessant appetite for power and the never satiable need for more.
I may be clouded in this but it almost seems to me that the writer is telling me that while he can be happy, he can never be truly whole without a man to validate his existence.
That to me is the saddest piece of crock ever. I resent the notion that everyone human being must get married or have a boyfriend/girlfriend so that he would be complete and that without it they will never ever be really happy.
Why can't we be really happy being single? Is getting a relationship a lifelong ambition for gays?
It is a cycle that all Life must experience so that we all won't regret....
Otto states "While it is true that many gay relationships do not work out, it is also true that gay relationships often lacked the community, familial and societal support that straight relationships take for granted." We would suggest (also from one of our previous experiences in the str8 world) that the "support" he mentions could be replaced by "pressure": "community, familial and societal pressure to keep the (str8) relationship alive; Just look at the example of Charles and Diana for instance. Of course, this "pressure" may work in the opposite way with a gay relationship: family, community and societal pressure to become "normal" and get a girlfriend, get married, have kids and lead a "happy life".
He also infers that children bind couples together but so do financial commitments and joint assets. Most str8 couples do not have the advantages of pre-nuptial contracts so partners stand to lose a heck of a lot of money if they split. Yet more "pressure" to stay together.
A final note. Relationships don't "just work". We used the garden metaphor above and, in continuation, you wouldn't invest years of time and money growing a garden without a little knowledge. Read about relationships, research them and ask others for help. This is a good starter: http://www.everydayhealth.com/family-health/understanding/ingredients-of-a-good-marriage.aspx?xid=nl_EverydayHealthEmotionalHealth_20100224
But are we talking about monogamous or open relationship? To some, being together can be open as well, whatever works for them for the physical thrill outside the relationship can bring. Is the relationship just about the duration of time? What's the quality of relationship? Is it 30 years of draggy-going-nowhere-I-wish-someone-better-instead-of-him/her relationship? or a shorter 5 years of solid relationship and yet still maintains that solid friendship? Couple should constantly look at themselves individually and as a couple to bring about a better life together.
There's no right formula to a lasting meaningful relationship. Love, Trust, hope, endearing, faithfulness, etc etc...the list goes on, they are there for those who practices it and stand the test of time. We can say all we want, but doing it is what it takes. There are so many factors affecting a relationship, but its doing what's neccessary to overcome those factors is what building a life together is all about.
I am single, I have been through relationships in the past. I don't count the days in the relationship, I make my days count as an individual and as a couple in the relationship. At the end of the day, it is not just being together, but HAPPILY together and better still, till death-do-us-part. :)
First, there is the matter of 'forever', 'til death do us part', and all that nonsense. If a relationship turns bad why would you want to prolong it? I have never 'vowed' anything to my partner. I have known several people who did, however, and it is clear from the results that vows have nothing whatsoever to do with it.
Second, relationships change with time. Often people grow apart, even amicably. I believe it is true about children holding straight couples together and I believe it is right. But how many times have you seen straight relationships fall apart when the children are gone, or elderly couples who despise each other?
Third, a relationship is work. It is not always fun work. There are a hundred things that can tear it apart other than infidelity. And with respect to fidelity, if one partner is going to throw away a perfectly good relationship because the other had a roll in the hay (especially if he was discreet about it), then the relationship is doomed. All men are sluts or wannabe sluts.
My advise: go into relationships, live with the person you want, don't hold your partner to a high expectation, be forgiving, and when it goes bad, really bad, move on to the next one. It is better, in my mind, to have a series of good relationships than one lifelong fight. One last thing; you are only young and sexy for a relatively short time. Don't waste your youth waiting for Mr. Right. In fact, there is no Mr. Right, but there might be a Mr. Pretty Good. You will find him not when you are looking, but when you are not.
Good luck everyone, and try to have some fun.
However, here's the twist. They no longer sleep in the same bedroom and havent had sex for quite a few years now. Instead, they have younger men, coming over to their place and have sex with either or both of them, but never at the same time.
They told me they still love me each other, but they just dont have sex together. I do not want to judge this relationship, but it does come across to me that they both knew that they are no longer young and needed to take care of each other in their old age. They have shared investments and properties and it will be a lot of hassles to go their separate ways.
Perhaps someone can tell me then, is this a true long lasting relationship or that they are just both smart enough to know the real consequences of not having each other in their retirement age.
All I can say that I am glad that I am still at a point in my life that I can do the right thing for myself and set myself up, both financially & in health, say if I will to go old by myself.
Something must be wrong with me then!
Another important aspect is the social climate surrounding the relationship - good friends, supporting families and something that gives both parties a centre of interest out side the relationship - children yes, but not at all necessarily.
In response to Capitan - nature has programmed the male to spread his seed call him a slut if you like
Relationships, either gay or straight, fail for the same reason. Too many go into a relationship for the wrong reasons. Real love or true companionship, things in common, seldom feature as reasons for a relationship, and THIS is why they fail. Never having been in a straight relationship, I can’t comment too much on it, but as for gay relationships, unfortunately more often than not, these are formed on the basis of physical attraction.
[Qhote: “a vow not to be taken lightly. It means that a partner vows to stay with another through thick and thin, riches and rags, in health and in sickness. My vow is to be with my partner when he contributes to our relationship. And my vow stands even when he is no longer able to contribute in certain ways (physical disability, aging complications). As long as he wants me around, and as long as I am capable of making decisions, I will be with him.” Unquote]
We know that nothing is forever, so to make a vow to anyone, be they gay or straight, is rather presumptuous. The problem lies in HOW relationships end. And therein lies the rub. More often than not, relationships end through infidelity, lack of interest and focus, etc. The list goes on and on. All reasons loosing sight of why one is in a relationship in the first place.
It takes hard work, EVERY DAY, and sadly, not enough people have realized this. There is no difference between gay and straight relationships, except in the bedroom. Someone said that two women in a relationship is more complicated? Why? As human beings we tend to make life more complicated than it is. We have to stop doing that, because in actual fact, life is very simple! Unfortunately as human beings, with money being the God of the 21st century. truth, honesty and integrity have taken a backseat. If we use common sense, most complications fall by the wayside. But we live in a world devoid of common sense, hence, our arguments, fights, skirmishes, and eventually wars.
St8t marriage is not the "answer", if it was how come the divorce rate is so high in countries like Australia?
"Being together" or a "relationship" is something very personal. Zorke cites an example which is very different to what many would see as a "good relationship"... but it sure works for those guys!!! We need to stay out of judgement territory, for example, if "open" is agreed and successful for two people, then it is a "good" relationship for them.
Having come off a 6 year gay relationship and a 20 year st8t marriage, I can confidently say in my opinon what makes for a long term relationship is both partners being prepared to "commit" and "put in", both prepared to talk honestly about the good and rough aspects and a genuine desire by both to "make it work". If those things do not come together, or if they do but the final relationship is not what either (or both) want, then it is time to leave. There is no point staying in a poisoned relationship or one where it is a one way street, but I also think there is no point to dropping the towel at the first sight of a bit of hard work.
I like the garden analogy, very apt guys!!
and so search and wait i will for the one whom will love me regardless of my appearance, wealth, and health.
Choose a partner with strong values.
Nevertheless we keep doing it in earnest because :
1. we are asleep (and dreaming) most of the time, including when we are not sleeping,
2. we believe that we are one person when in fact we are many. The one who promises is but one in a crowd, and yet he constantly makes promises not just in his name but for the whole crowd.
Crowds are unpredictable and mostly uncontrollable. So are human beings, no matter how much they love to think of themselves as rational, reliable and consistent. Our beloved and highly (over)priced "values" such as integrity, faithfulness, selflessness, are no more real than love in Bollywood movies.
However, if either or both of them had felt only physical (or financial) attraction, without friendship at an emotional level, then I'd say there's not much to hold them together. Sex or money as the only attraction just cannot endure the test of time, since these things can disappear or be offered by others too.
All the rationalising that you do, about how you're "supposed to be together" because "that's the right thing to do", and so on, may only result in a very unhappy relationship. You must WANT to be together emotionally, without requiring logical justifications.
i never have relationship b4 so i dont know much about how long its last , but this 3 steps , im gona do with my future partner ! :)
We gave it a good 8 years. 7 of it was the happiest time of my life. The last one really sucked but I miss him terribly.
What was the question again?
No matter how things workout, i guess guys or gals should know themselves better. So if have the faith to be together, everything will have come.
I'm very much theoretical. Sad to say, Ive never tried to have that kind of relationship. Its very much difficult for me to open this identity to the public and even to my family and friends.
I do hope, I can find the right partner that could love me unconditionally despite for what I am and for who I am.
Without a doubt, I am just being true to my self!
"Analyses revealed that participants in committed or legally recognized relationships reported less psychological distress (i.e., internalized homophobia, depressive symptoms, and stress) and more well-being (i.e., the presence of meaning in life) than single participants. Significant group differences and multivariate analyses indicated that participants in a legally recognized relationship reported less internalized homophobia, fewer depressive symptoms, lower levels of stress, and more meaning in their lives than those in committed relationships, even after controlling for other factors."
(Riggle, Ellen D. B; Rostosky, Sharon S; Horne, Sharon G. Psychological distress, well-being, and legal recognition in same-sex couple relationships. Journal of Family Psychology. Vol.24(1), Feb 2010, pp. 82-86. )
I also remember a study which found that married couples felt pride when their spouses experience success, while unmarried couples were more likely to feel jealous and resentful. It can be seen then that there may be at least one less source of tension within marriages.
And just because you feel differently and you cite your own experiences to refute others, remember that we do have cognitive biases. We look to confirm our beliefs and end up ignoring everything else.
But I do agree that Cloud was a bit dodgy there... How could he say this:
"Our relationship had begun to suffer the inanition of many marriages at seven years. (The seven-year itch isn't a myth; the U.S. Census Bureau says the median duration of first marriages that end in divorce is 7.9 years.)"
Then go on to argue that homosexual relationships don't last as long as heterosexual ones?
Firstly, in my own case and to "lay my cards on the table", my (Singaporean) partner and I have been together for 15 years now, and still going strong... if not stronger than when we first met, as I think we have both matured a lot in that time, and we have both also learned to deal with the occasional conflicts and disagreements that sometimes arise in ALL relationships... straight OR gay. It's the way we deal with those conflicts that determines how, and whether, the relationship will last, and we had discussed that very topic many years ago, so we both know how to deal with each other on the (very) rare occasion we might have a disagreement on something.
Unlike a straight marriage, gay relationships have two factors missing that help keep straight couples together, for better or worse. The first is a legal marriage contract which makes it more difficult and/or costly to separate. (Although in places like Australia where gay relationships ARE recognised... that is not so relevent now, as it can be sometimes costly in terms of property settlement etc. if a gay couple does ultimately separate.) The other factor is children, and Otto alluded to this as well. Even if a straight relationship is "on the rocks", the parents will try to keep the relationship going solely because of the children... or at least until they have grown up and moved on.
Gay couples (in general...) can separate so much more easily without the same considerations that straight couples have to contend wth. If they did not have the legal marriage contract, and children, then I think you would find that straight couples would be having much shorter relationships as well.
And I say that as a gay man who "came out" 19 years ago, but who was married for 16 years before that, and who has two adult children.
i like this article, the movie just mention it, it is true love....!
A Midsummer Nights Dream...
that said, it does feel empty sometimes ... ... ... for that sheer shared intimacy that a deep and devoted relationship provides ... well ... till then, i am staying well and happy ... and content
;) good nite
I guess most gay couple stayed together becoz of the companionship, someone to have dinner with, someone to go grocery shopping with, and someone to sleep with at night....
I myself had never been in a relationship before.
But I find comfort in the lights of Leonardo and Michelangelo, both of whom are single for most if not all their life's.
In place of that void, they achieved great things.
I like to see myself as that...
If nothing else, as a comfort thought for me.
Communication, honesty & understanding that people change, grow older & knowing that hot young guy you met when you were in your 20's is still the same person today.
We will be celebrating our 18 years together soon, have good family & friends around us.
Maybe we are one lucky 1's, we compromise (not to be selfish), & let what any human would want, let each other be an individual !!
I've been with my partner now for 21 years, we laugh a lot with and at each other every day, and really do say "I love you" every day, and mean it deeply, the love has increased as the years go by.
One friend died recently, he'd been with his partner about 60 years.
So, of course gay relationships last, if that is what you want, and, I guess, if that is the expectation you have. If you have a belief or expectation that gay relationships don't last, then I guess you are more likely to fullfil that expectation.
It is not based on gender, sexuality or the presence of children, it is based on the individual and how they view or is able to respect the commitment or vow they have made, be it legally or privately. The further reality is that there are many who cheated who are in love with the spouse/partner when they did it; however, they were not strong enough to resist the temptation. Therefore, it is not just about love, it goes, I believe, to a deeper issue. Interestingly, I have also had gay couples in to see me, and the issues are usually the same as straight couples. My conclusion is that it is a human thing not a gay or love thing.
"My vow is to be with my partner when he contributes to our relationship. And my vow stands even when he is no longer able to contribute in certain ways (physical disability, aging complications). As long as he wants me around, and as long as I am capable of making decisions, I will be with him."
It takes 2 to achieve the above and I personally quoted and pinned this to myself the moment I knew I was gay...
It's frustrating when I only have short-term relationship that usually says : "Let’s stay together if we’re happy and it works for both of us. Once it stops working for either of us, let’s split." Truly there's nothing wrong with it, but I can't live with it.
..even straight relationships does not have any assurance..but its between two people who would want to continue and end the relationship..
for me its really hard,. but i believe in love last forever,. all you have to do is to have faith, respect, and trust. whos you in..
Of course it between you and your partner....the most important is trust and being loyal. :-)
Really need to have good communication with each other, understanding and getting to know how each other's future going to be like, in order to have the same mindset. Perhaps the person I am with now, is like treating me a spare tyre. Maybe I should find someone who is really serious in relationship, or let it comes naturally.
One thing, in the search for Prince or Princess Charming, I've found that some people, particularly straight career women I know, had a list of what they wanted in a partner, down to the type of car they drive. Of course, no one ever lived up to their expectations. If anyone has such a list, I suggest they throw it away and just be open to possibilities, even to people they don't consider to be their "type". The ones that made a conscious decision to do this are now happily married.
Encouraging and inspiring~
I've got so much to learn...
can the relationship HAPPY? ermm... maybe not. gays are men, which mean we are all having another instinct, to play with another person.. we may say we love our partner / husband, but we still .... will eat outside sometimes! so, there's no point discussing all this ...
depend on how you look at this, for me its all bull crap.. for those who say they are loyal to THE ONE and ONLY, ask yourself, are you sure?
In the end the only good is that they can breed beautiful people like us ...
I have met many Straight people in my life that have been sleeping around the partners backs .. heck I even slept with many so called Married straight..
In the end we are all the same ...
In the end the only good is that they can breed beautiful people like us ...
I have met many Straight people in my life that have been sleeping around the partners backs .. heck I even slept with many so called Married straight men ..
In the end we are all the same ...
applaud these words:
'Sure, some of us can achieve these singlehandedly. But one thing I learnt when I climbed the Grand Canyon in Colorado, US, alone and witnessed a breathtaking sunrise there two decades ago: I wanted that special someone to share that awesome sight with me. Always.'
their love can survivie lack of proceation, arthirities and death, and combined with the main picture of aged men's bodies should remind gay men that if we want relationships to last, maybe we should prepared for age spots, wrinkles and many other irritations thaat may arise as 2 individuals stay together.
its a tough order, but maybe love is worth it
I think it takes extreme respect and trust on both sides, and an open heart(not to be confused with open relationships) and not to want anything more than to give love with no expectations. It can evolve and change with time if you are willing to also learn from your partner. One doesn't have all the answers.
I really feel sorry for those that are not out, because lying about this part of life will affect your gay relationship.
But, its not the only point to look at things.
Though I might not have statistics and I will not have a way to get them. I personally do feel that gay relationship doesnt last is mainly due to the "mind".
Some can differentiate love and sex. And most of all, I personally feel gays, (men), use their tools to think. What will sexually arouse you, your love or relationship will get jeopadized.
In gay love and relationship, being honest, trust and open to each other in every expect is more important and lead the relationship longer. Some how without good communication, once missed understanding happen then it will cause many possibilities of break up, and all these are same for heterosexual marriage.
To me, i do love some one very much and i do understand he do love me in return but in a very different way that he don't love me as a lover but still very much care for me as a son of him. To me its just one way traffic and yet still love him so much and we do take good care for each other. of course we do have 4 wonderful years together and now we still are fine with what we have now and he very honest to me that he'll still look for his love one but at the same time he will never dump me for the other party and some more the one that he love must accept me as one family and he said that if he do find some one that so selfish to ask him dump me for them being together, he'll never do that cos he do love me also and selfish kind of love will never be true love and also may not last long.
With this great man in my life, even i dont get lover's kind of love in return but i never regret that i know some one so nice to me and love me as well even we are not mean to be lover but still a good companion and in a nice family. Is that nice in gay relationship.
Comes to any kind of relationship or friendship, respect to each other and treasure every moment in life is a very good experience to everyone. The most important is we truly treat other people from the bottom of our heart.
For those who separated due to missed understanding, i feel so sorry to them. for those who now in relationship with some one special, communication in life, trust, respect and all expect are very important to keep the relationship lasting and even more. For those who still single, i wish all will find their love ones very soon and when found some one, really treasure the relationship will kind heart, trust true to each other. Also in what ever kind of situation you are now, never ever have the thought of take things for granted from the other party because its only will make the other one keep a distance more.
Heteros have it easy because most often the common goal is children and when the welfare of the children is not the common goal then even those relationships can fail.
Where there is a common goal both partners are prepared to commit and adapt and compromise because the goal is paramount. With a goal a relationship can survive without love and without sex but with both it makes survival a whole lot easier. But neither sex nor love on its own is sufficient goal for survival
In Malaysia where real relationships are extremely rare... mostly they are distant fuckbuddyships... relationships are guaranteed to fail because the common goal is usually "me"
Certainly, as a young man I never dreamed I would be able to find the happiness that I have. Now that my same-sex spouse and I are approaching old age, we are having to face the reality that one of us one day will be left alone. (We have been together for more than 33 years.) If I survive my spouse, I do not believe I will feel the terrible loneliness I felt as a young man who thought he would never be able to find happiness as a gay man. I now have the knowledge that lifelong gay love is indeed possible ... and I will have wonderful memories to sustain me.
I do think straight people have more support to try and get their marriage right than gay people, inspite of all kinds of odds being stacked against them-- there exisits lots of support groups, charities, friends, and a legal system that protects family interests
But once gay men and women get married, purchase a home together, be accountable to families, and settle down and have kids, and begin taking care of their elderly parents... of course these responsiiblities bring more stability and less selfishness and narcism....
personally I think the biggest threat to gay relationships is that sex is not like fast food, too many easy distractions-- lots of gay men my Dad's age look back at the good old days when gay relationships were tender and simple with less distractions
Eventhough I am single, I will always believe in love and that there is a Mr Right out there for everyone!;-)
I have friends that have been in committed relationship for over 50 years, and several friends that are in for anywhere from 25 to 40 years.
Of course these couples are not going out to bars or dancing anymore.
Being in my early 50s I can attest than even when I was much younger and carefree (pre-aids crisis), I was very much influenced by the example of older friends and colleagues who were in relationships that lasted longer that the average straight marriage.
The fact that few young people see these role models who started their love story when all of this was illegal throughout the world, probably reinforce de stereotype of gay relationship not lasting.
I am proof that relationships last a very long time, going on my 30s anniversary with a wonderful man.
Don't let people decide what you should think. Be happy, be honest with yourself and your lover, do what is right for your couple, and you will succeed.
Physical beauty is only skin dip and very temporary. Know who you are, what you like and go get it. It is there for the taking
Best of luck
I guess my point is, most guys want a committed relationship, only a few guys both str8 and gay go on to be life long T room Queens, the rest of us search out the right guy and settle down and hope it lasts.
Tom, Long Beach, Ca.
and suddenly.. on that nite his house mate came back from work, found him DEAD! NAKED! and Hands/Legs tied to his bed.
Police Verdicts, HEART ATTACK after sex. Nothing's taken in his home.
So... motives is.. Thou GAY RELATIONSHIPS can last FOREVER but Can we make it FOREVER?
As a close friens, It took me 2 months to forget him. But still WONDERING..? What happened to all his APPOINTMENTS, HIS UPCOMING OVERSEAS TRIPS, TRAVELS, HIS PROPERTIES and so on.. worst is.. the 2 boys he giving academic supports.. what will happend to them and their futures?
so guys... THINK POSITIVE all the way in our lives.. in any RELATIONSHIPS.. SEX is Partial.. TRUST, UNDERSTANDING and FLEXIBILITY is the key to staying fit and keeping realtionships longer.
We have Up's and Down's.. Hurts & Love.. Tears & laughters... most important is.. LOVE YOURSELVES first. Before you could love others.
take care.... God Bless all of you.. those whom was Hurt.. Give yrself a 2nd Chanced. Asked me anything.. i'll be delighted to answer it Openly.
Personally, I haven't been into any real relationship. Shall I attach to someone in the future? Will that relationship last forever? Who knows?
Things happen for its reason.
You can find someone you love. But you can't tie him up if you guys can't make your relationship work.
Maybe heterosexual relationships have more supports from social aspects than homosexual ones, but if you and your partner couldn't make it work, no body could either.
To me, there is no forever love but there are romantic, beautiful loves that make us treasure our lives.
Good luck with your lives, guys! :)
Whether it is a right or wrong decision, whether it will last long or not, one way to find out - that is to get involved :)
Still, great to see a few good role models within the comments section :)
On a different note, have any entrepreneurial types out there set up some sort of gay relationship counselling centre in Singapore? (There are probably such services... but just not as well advertised as the saunas :)
The thing is, we hear often from them, but not enough from the glbt men and women who have settled down to a life like Carl and Ellie's. I am in my late 30s and I personally know many many couples, gay and lesbian who have been and are still in longterm relationships. The years they have been together range from 21yrs to 30yrs. It's really sweet to see them.
I think the gay community is often too harsh on ourselves because we have gotten used to the harshness and condemnation from the heterosexual community and we unconsciously believe what they say: 'gay relationships don't last', 'gay people are promiscuous', 'gay is a lifestyle that includes drugs and partying, that's why they don't last', etc etc.
Look at the straight world. In the states, 50% of straight marriages end in divorce. In Singapore and other first world nations, 30% end in divorces. Look at the Tiger Woods, Jack Neo, don't you think the former probablly is more prolific than any gay man is rumoured to be?
So I throw it back at the straight world. There is no such thing as an ideal relationship and/or marriage. We all do the best we can. And as the world gets messier and gay people come out more, our stats will equalise.
And gay relationships are just as good if not better, cos we are clearer about what we want. Cos it's so much harder for us, let us love ourselves more and treasure our relationships more instead of letting it go when the sun comes up. We need to build up the tools, that's all - learning how to fight the right way for eg. @65, dreagon999 put it best already.
I know lots of people that got into relationships for the sake of security. This in my view is wrong, gay people need to have the confidence to be able to be single and thus treat there partner as more than just security.
the question, HOW?
it is not so difficult, and we are just lacking the advantages and privileges straight couples have when they are in a relationship.
in singapore, publicity is very crucial. me and my partner always feel closed and insecure whenever we want to show affections in a crowd or in any public places.
we dont really need marriage or those kind of things. the first thing we need is Acceptance from the people. (:
"IN LOVE" but no "LOVE"
not "IN LOVE" but "LOVE"
"IN LOVE" and "LOVE"
I wonder which will turn out to be a long term relationship? what do you think?
But of cause things are not as simple as that! there are two in a relationship, so if we double up the combination, the chances of a perfect match is made in heaven.
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